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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 23 post(s) |
Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.22 07:48:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 22/12/2009 07:56:02
First off: thank you, thank you, thank you!
 Originally by: CCP Awesome
They are also set to orbit at 7.5k which puts them outside of all but the most powerful smart bomb range.
orbit really should be upped to 8000m. mere faction emp smarties (which are not terribly uncommon on carriers and would certainly improve in popularity with FBs in game) shouldn't be in range. this would unfortunately also take hakim's and thon's out of the running but every other officer SB that could hit them at 7500m orbit would be unaffected.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.22 22:17:00 -
[2]
Originally by: RoCkEt X
FB's vs Smartbombs:
tbh fighters dont instapop to Smarties unless theres 5+ smarties going off. as a MS pilot myself, i feel it would be overpowered to have fighterbombers orbit outside of officer smartbomb range, i feel 7.5km is justified and balanced
They don't need to orbit outside of officer SB range but they shouldn't be orbiting in range of mere faction emp smartbombs.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.25 21:43:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 25/12/2009 21:46:16
Originally by: Kalissa
But seriously, the biggest arguement people seem to have about MS's not being able to dock is "docking games"?
The biggest argument is that not being able to dock is the single greatest limit on their proliferation. People simply bring up the "docking games" thing more because that will be the (direct) negative consequence most people would experience from it. I support an outpost addon that is enormously expensive and difficult to acquire, but they should never be able to dock in normal stations.
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so unless the devs changes the physical size so they actually look like super capitals visually and not just in the statistics i say make em dock.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.28 02:26:00 -
[4]
Originally by: CCP Abathur
Fighter Bomber damage - with max skills, 20 Fighter Bombers will do 8000 DPS; 10000 DPS with the Nyx.
-That's a pretty serious reduction from (your) initial values. Any chance DCUs are going to be made useful/effective to counteract this?
-What exp velocity/rad should we be expecting to see?
-Please keep a very keen eye on issues with FB survivability. I still think there is zero reason at this point to not bump orbit up to 8km. navy emp SBs should not be hitting orbitting FBs
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.28 16:44:00 -
[5]
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=CCP Abathur]The Fighter Bombers that Supercarriers launch can deal approximately 2x the damage of a dread with max skills. This damage is unaffected by the tracking penalties imposed by the XL turrets on Titans or the Siege Module on Dreads and the torpedoes that Fighter Bombers launch have a much higher explosion velocity than their capital-launched counterparts. So while the damage is 'only' 2x the damage of a dread, they are much more effective against moving capital ship targets.
Yes, but a dread's damage source can't be completely wiped out by a few smartbombing carriers/BS or a few bombs, causing a few hundred mill in damage in the process and requiring F/Bs at 7500m3 a pop to be hauled out to whatever pos the mom goes back to.
Originally by: CCP Abathur
Originally by: Natasha Nikolaev
-That's a pretty serious reduction from (your) initial values. Any chance DCUs are going to be made useful/effective to counteract this?
The initial values were 9600 DPS (12000 Nyx).
And the new values are significantly lower than this.
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Each DCU fit will continue to allow one more Fighter or Fighter Bomber to be controlled.
Meaning they aren't going to be made useful/effective. We both know no one is going to sacrifice a high slot for 5% more damage. One would need to use up 4 (!!!) of their 6 high slots to get to the damage output you originally proposed.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.28 18:05:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 28/12/2009 18:05:53
Originally by: Van Feneal
Given that hel and minnie in general are known for less tank and more damage, at least the idea CCP planted in my head since I started in 2003, If the HEL still does not have a usable tank as compared to the other Motherships the Hel should get a very decent and good bonus to damage on bombers AND fighters AND drones.
so you want it to have the nyx's bonus, but better. That makes no sense. And minnie aren't about "less tank, more damage" they are about "less tank, more speed"
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.29 02:30:00 -
[7]
Originally by: ByFstugan
I agree with you that the Drone Control Units are terrible, they should give 2 extra drones per level on SC's imo. Also the Hel bonus as U say need change, I've stated my suggestion earlier so I skip that now. But I'd like to point out to CCP that it will be really unfair to the Hel pilots to not change that bonus together with the removal of the Triage module that was the only thing that could spice it up.
I agree they are terrible, I disagree with how this should be solved. 2 extra drones per level could cause issues with carrier dps and also causes issues with fighter bombers and drone bay sizes. The only (good) way to make DCUs useful is drop the whole increasing # of drones controlled and simply go with increased damage and HP. This will scale properly between carriers and motherships (thus not causing issues with gank thanatos dps), won't increase lag and will make fighters/FBs more survivable all in one shot.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.30 01:28:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Ardetia
now, if a DD could be used as a turret instead of 1 per titan, such as Titan 5 = 5 DD's then THAT would make people pull out their titans
5 beams, 10 min wait = ok in my book
Please, don't post again.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2009.12.30 04:39:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 30/12/2009 04:39:55
Originally by: Ardetia
let me see here, oh yea, how about you post something relevant to the thread here
and yes i exaggerated but i fail to see how the current titans are nothing but bridge alts
If you had actually read the thread you would know I have posted in here multiple times (not to mention all my posts in previous SC-related threads).
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.01 17:12:00 -
[10]
Originally by: LoveKebab
if u cant watch for ur drones than ur not supose to use a carrier, it's a simple thing - u see that ur fighters being hit by something u scoop just the one whos being pwned or lock it and try to rr OR u scoop ALL fighters and use sentry drones from a safe distance - ffs u should have at least 50km rep range anyway...
I hope you're not suggesting that scooping FBs and dropping T2 sentries is a viable alternative for SCs.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.01 21:16:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 01/01/2010 21:21:18
Originally by: RoCkEt X
you see a bomb/smarties, you pull your fighters back, its the way it works now, its the way it has always been and its the way it always will be.
pulling fighters/FBs back = zero dps. The reason why this isn't as big of an issue with fighters on carriers is that in larger fights carriers are tasked with logistics, not dps. SCs are the opposite. If SCs have to recall their FBs every time a few smartbombs come into play or a few bombers come out, they aren't worth using in any sizable fight.
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fighters now respond instantly
Except, you know, when it's very laggy, such as in a fleet fight, which is the main place SCs will be used. However it's obviously greatly improved from how it was.
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which is enough to survive 5 bombs
Which, coincidentally, is 1-2 less bombs than are generally launched at one time by bomber gangs.
And even if they only launch 5 (or only five hit), what then? you return them to orbit and spend the next however many minutes locking and repping all 20 FBs while contributing exactly nothing to your fleet? Even when you're all done repping, shield reppers still have zero armor and low structure on their FBs and armor reppers are a bit better off as they have no shield/low structure but at least the shield will rep over time.
I'm not agreeing with the need for smartbomb/bomb resistance "role bonus", just saying you're downplaying the danger of them far too much
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.02 00:44:00 -
[12]
Originally by: NedFromAssembly
Oh god you have to micromanage your ****, its terrible. Almost like you have to actually play the game.
So every 15 seconds or so you have to recall and reengage your FBs, for the duration of any fight involving numerous smartbombs. I hardly see that as a practical solution.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.02 01:37:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 02/01/2010 01:41:12
Originally by: SolarKnight
Anyone who has flown any kind of drone ship, knows that as soon as you start taking damage to your drones, you pull them back and then throw them back at the target, its like a reflex, either that or you rep them with a high slot rep (or you can take the chance of the target dying first but thats more risky).
And this is the sort of micromanaging I was referring to with "and there is already..." What Ned is referring to is not this, it is in addition to this. there is a difference between recalling and redeploying drones to break locks (or returning damaged drones and spitting out new ones) and being required to repeatedly hit whatever 2 hotkeys you set to "return to orbit" and "engage target" every 12-14 seconds for the duration of an engagement.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.02 02:04:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 02/01/2010 02:06:58
Originally by: NedFromAssembly
Yes in one you use 2 hotkeys to recall and deploy, in another you hit two hotkeys to moderate their range.
But in one case you are doing it relatively infrequently. In another you are guaranteed to be doing it every ~14 seconds.
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and it amazes me none of you see how insanely powerful these ships are going to be.
everything else staying how it is, FB survivability/usability will be the determining factor in their success in capital engagements. If it turns out FBs dont start dropping like flies then yes, they will be amazing.
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Sorry but letting these orbit too far out would cause some real problems in my opinion
I personally was rather guarded on them having too great of an orbit range. However I did and still do think they need to be moved up to 8km. navy emp smarties should not be able to hit FBs.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.03 15:04:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Vincent Jarjadian
Can someone from CCP confirm if Fighter Bombers can be assigned to other ships like normal fighters?
I am quite sure they can not ne assigned.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.04 04:55:00 -
[16]
Originally by: LoveKebab
nyx keeps it bonus for fighters ONLY
fighters only? you're even dumber than I thought.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.04 16:43:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 04/01/2010 16:47:03
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 04/01/2010 16:43:40
Originally by: LoveKebab
u r obviously a nyx owner, there was no other reason for u to jumping on some1 with an IDEA while have none...
I've posted in this and previous threads on the subject many times. I am sure you can figure out why a fighter-only bonus on any SC is a terrible idea.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.05 00:37:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 05/01/2010 00:45:30
Originally by: LoveKebab
also what u expect to get resists for ? since bonuses should be unique im pretty sure the only thing that's left for improved resists is structure...
Sorry I was not clear. resists were for fighters/bombers not the ship. 33% effective ehp increase and if you actually do manage to lock one of your own before it dies, will help with keeping it alive. Given the PITA and cost of replacing FBs and if you lose a full or majority of a flight you're SOL due to not being able to carry near a full set of replacements (hel can carry 29 FBs plus regular drones) FB survivability bonus is not a bad way to go. In the same line of thought Hel could simply get 10% fighter/FB HP per lvl bonus. Loses the increased "FB tanking" but more EHP.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.05 02:56:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 05/01/2010 02:59:18
Originally by: ByFstugan
My personal choice:
My choice would be still your second choice on SiSi, the fighter Bomber explosion speed (suggestion 2) so it hit moving/smaller targets better (or 3% to both explosion radius and damage).
Second best might be to split bonus to 3% Shield Resist (as Caldari) and 3% Damage to Fighters/FB's (as Gallente)
The explosion speed idea really only helps with carriers/supercaps and subcaps. As dreads *will* be the main target (by far) in the capital arena, exp vel. bonus helps them against capitals only marginally and certainly less than the Nyx's bonus, which helps against all capitals equally. Given that even with an exp vel. bonus they will still be quite poor against subcaps (which shouldn't be a focus for them, anyways), I have to disagree with you on the value of such a bonus. I *DO* agree that their bonus should not be in personal defense, but offense-oriented via bonus to fighters/FBs. Straight up damage bonus is already taken and as I explained above I really do not thing exp rad or velocity bonus would make much sense. As for your second option, I personally do not think split bonuses will give enough of an increase to either Hel survivability or damage to make a worthwhile difference in either department. It's a "jack of all trades" thing but unfortunately EVE tends to heavily fabor the masters, not the jacks.
Significant increase to FB survivability equals less dead FBs, which means lower PITA and cost of ownership as well as significantly decreased likelihood of ending up in a situation where you dont even have a full 20 FBs to field. It isn't an increase in your ability to do damage, but it IS an increase in your ability to do damage over the whole of a capital engagement.
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.05 11:22:00 -
[20]
Originally by: LoveKebab
i proposed EHP bonus couple pages back as it was one of the ideas behind the original changes but had no feedback from a dev :(
tho this change seems reasonable as a counterpart to dps bonus - either this one or that one :)
Well at least we agree on something. 
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.09 17:16:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Natasha Nikolaev on 09/01/2010 17:23:22
Originally by: Ezekiel Sulastin
*curls into a little ball and cries himself to sleep after /wristing*
I stand corrected, and am firing my clumsy fingers for typos and brain for not catching them, o glorious dispenser of greater wisdom >.> Now I'm trying to figure out how people say that ROF bonus > damage bonus, but I don't have the time to atm
Because rof bonus is greater than dmg bonus. (assuming lvl 5 skills) 4% rof bonus would equal 5% dmg bonus. whereas 5% rof bonus would equate to a 6.66% damage bonus. They aren't going to give the Hel a 5% rof bonus for two reasons: it will increase lag and it will give it better dps than the nyx
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.11 16:11:00 -
[22]
Originally by: LoveKebab
Originally by: hatchette
Aren't they supposed to be able to hit an onlined POS?
That there be dread territory
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Natasha Nikolaev
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Posted - 2010.01.14 15:45:00 -
[23]
Originally by: EliteSlave
Problems with a marauder style bonus would be,
1) They will carry less ammo
2) Less Ammo means more Stront.
3) More stront means more cycles.
4) More Cycles, means unbalances the other dreads.
^this
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